US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
Businesses that behave like US Airways do not deserve to survive. One
gets the feeling US Airways is run by vultures picking over the
carcass of a dying business. Travelers beware!
Regards,
Ray Lozano
Dallas, Texas
www.usairways.tv
Miguel Cruz
09-09-2003, 06:18 AM
Ray Lozano <raylozano@eudoramail.com> wrote:
> US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
> record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
> site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
>
> Businesses that behave like US Airways do not deserve to survive. One
> gets the feeling US Airways is run by vultures picking over the
> carcass of a dying business. Travelers beware!
I don't get it. You didn't have your travel documents, which are required by
law. You then went out and bought one-way tickets on a different airline
rather than following the instructions given by the USAir person to contact
your travel agency.
If you had called the travel agency they could have gotten you on the next
USAir flight, possibly at a cost of $700 but definitely not at a cost of
$4800.
Also, if you had talked with anyone about your plan to purchase the one-way
tickets on American they could have told you that your USAir return tickets
would be voided by failure to use the outbound.
And now you want USAir to pay you thousands of dollars?
miguel
--
Hit The Road! Photos and tales from around the world: http://travel.u.nu
>I don't get it.
>
>And now you want USAir to pay you thousands of dollars?
You're missing the simple fact that many people aren't prepared to
accept they made a mistake (or lots in this case) and swallow their
pride. They have to blame someone else.
Jim.
Keith Willshaw
09-09-2003, 06:58 AM
"Ray Lozano" <raylozano@eudoramail.com> wrote in message
news:bbdaa33f.0309081055.13f8df2f@posting.google.com...
> US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
> record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
> site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
>
Lets see
You booked a flight which you missed because you didnt check you had
appropriate travel documents until 24 hours before the trip and
somehow its their fault !
Airlines are NOT PERMITTED to allow people on international flights
without adequate documentation, you screwed up, deal with it.
Keith
Charlie Hammond
09-09-2003, 07:32 AM
In article <bbdaa33f.0309081055.13f8df2f@posting.google.com>,
raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray Lozano) writes:
>US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
>record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
>site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
Others have pointed out that you messed up by not having the proper
documents available -- but then, you knew that, right?
While you are at fault, I agree with you that US Airways could and
probably should have made a bit more of an effort to help you.
If you account is complete and accurate, it sounds like you were
extremely unlucky to deal with some employees who were clearly not
customer oriented.
I am not too surprised that your letter has not yet been answered.
Give them another week and then follow up. Be persistent and keep
your cool. Hopefully they will make some accomodation, perhaps
crediting your full ticket amount against future flights; maybe
even refunding it outrigh. Unfortunately, I doubt that they will
pay for the other tickets you purchased.
In retrospect, if you had retrieved your documents and then returned
to US Air, I suspect they might have found a way to accomodate you.
Do please post/publish US Air's response, good or bad.
By the way -- your birth certificates have little monetary value and
can be easily replaced (time permitting, of course -- and assuming you
were born in the USA). Why do you keep them in a safe deposit box?
--
Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA
(hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)
All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.
Keeger
09-09-2003, 09:16 AM
jim@jibbering.com (Jim Ley) wrote:
>You're missing the simple fact that many people aren't prepared to
>accept they made a mistake (or lots in this case) and swallow their
>pride. They have to blame someone else.
>Jim.
God bless America! I think he should sue for at least 3 billion
dollars.
K
mtbchip
09-09-2003, 11:32 AM
in article bbdaa33f.0309081055.13f8df2f@posting.google.com, Ray Lozano at
raylozano@eudoramail.com wrote on 9/8/03 11:55 AM:
> US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
> record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
> site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
>
> Businesses that behave like US Airways do not deserve to survive. One
> gets the feeling US Airways is run by vultures picking over the
> carcass of a dying business. Travelers beware!
>
> Regards,
> Ray Lozano
> Dallas, Texas
> www.usairways.tv
Lozano translates to loser in some other language. Be a big boy and swallow
your mistakes.
BZEFIRST
09-09-2003, 11:36 AM
I've flown USAir many times and find this airline about the same as any of the
others. No better, no worse.
--Lan Sluder
Hatunen
09-09-2003, 02:23 PM
On 8 Sep 2003 20:38:47 -0700, raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray
Lozano) wrote:
>mnc@admin.u.nu (Miguel Cruz) wrote in message news:<xC47b.12835$98.4323@nwrddc03.gnilink.net>...
>> And now you want USAir to pay you thousands of dollars?
>
>You did not read my letter very well. I called US Airways the evening
>before. I went to the ticket counter at 4:00 AM to show a good faith
>attempt to make the flight. I called the travel agency who issued the
>tickets the moment they opened. The problem: No one would help.
Your screed does not make it clear just who required the
documents; was it the ariline or was it the destination country?
If the destination country, what, exactly, did you want the
airline to do and how are they responsible for it?
Would a passport have satisifed everyone?
When we're about to make an international flight we make sure all
our papers are in order at least a week before the flight, and
now you can see why.
************* DAVE HATUNEN (hatunen@cox.net) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
Hatunen
09-09-2003, 02:24 PM
On 8 Sep 2003 20:46:05 -0700, raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray
Lozano) wrote:
>"Keith Willshaw" <keith@kwillshaw_NoSpam.demon.co.uk> wrote in message news:<bjin1q$f6n$1$8302bc10@news.demon.co.uk>...
>> "Ray Lozano" <raylozano@eudoramail.com> wrote in message
>> news:bbdaa33f.0309081055.13f8df2f@posting.google.com...
>> > US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
>> > record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
>> > site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
>> >
>>
>> Lets see
>>
>> You booked a flight which you missed because you didnt check you had
>> appropriate travel documents until 24 hours before the trip and
>> somehow its their fault !
>>
>> Airlines are NOT PERMITTED to allow people on international flights
>> without adequate documentation, you screwed up, deal with it.
>>
>> Keith
>
>You don't read well and your writing is bad. The issue is not about
>personal responsibility, but about how an airline should behave toward
>its customers, who are human.
I gather you weren't really the airline's customer: you got your
tickets from a consolidator or bucket shop.
************* DAVE HATUNEN (hatunen@cox.net) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
Ray Lozano
09-09-2003, 02:32 PM
hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond) wrote in message news:<lH57b.4253$ve5.3416@news.cpqcorp.net>...
> In article <bbdaa33f.0309081055.13f8df2f@posting.google.com>,
> raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray Lozano) writes:
>
> >US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
> >record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
> >site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
>
> Others have pointed out that you messed up by not having the proper
> documents available -- but then, you knew that, right?
>
> While you are at fault, I agree with you that US Airways could and
> probably should have made a bit more of an effort to help you.
> If you account is complete and accurate, it sounds like you were
> extremely unlucky to deal with some employees who were clearly not
> customer oriented.
>
> I am not too surprised that your letter has not yet been answered.
> Give them another week and then follow up. Be persistent and keep
> your cool. Hopefully they will make some accomodation, perhaps
> crediting your full ticket amount against future flights; maybe
> even refunding it outrigh. Unfortunately, I doubt that they will
> pay for the other tickets you purchased.
>
> In retrospect, if you had retrieved your documents and then returned
> to US Air, I suspect they might have found a way to accomodate you.
>
> Do please post/publish US Air's response, good or bad.
>
> By the way -- your birth certificates have little monetary value and
> can be easily replaced (time permitting, of course -- and assuming you
> were born in the USA). Why do you keep them in a safe deposit box?
Charlie,
Thank you for actually reading what is on my web site. Sure, we goofed
up because our birth certificates had been put into safe deposit, but
my point is that US Airways did nothing to help us and kept our money
despite my efforts.
Good businesses follow the Golden Rule. It's really very simple.
Predatory businesses, on the other hand, seize opportunities to take
people's money in a zero-sum game in the way my situation was handled
by US Airways.
Yes, I do plan to publish US Airways' response to my letter.
Best regards,
Ray Lozano
www.usairways.tv
P.S. We will never again put our birth certificates in safe deposit.
Ray Lozano
09-09-2003, 02:38 PM
mnc@admin.u.nu (Miguel Cruz) wrote in message news:<xC47b.12835$98.4323@nwrddc03.gnilink.net>...
> Ray Lozano <raylozano@eudoramail.com> wrote:
> > US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
> > record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
> > site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
> >
> > Businesses that behave like US Airways do not deserve to survive. One
> > gets the feeling US Airways is run by vultures picking over the
> > carcass of a dying business. Travelers beware!
>
> I don't get it. You didn't have your travel documents, which are required by
> law. You then went out and bought one-way tickets on a different airline
> rather than following the instructions given by the USAir person to contact
> your travel agency.
>
> If you had called the travel agency they could have gotten you on the next
> USAir flight, possibly at a cost of $700 but definitely not at a cost of
> $4800.
>
> Also, if you had talked with anyone about your plan to purchase the one-way
> tickets on American they could have told you that your USAir return tickets
> would be voided by failure to use the outbound.
>
> And now you want USAir to pay you thousands of dollars?
>
> miguel
Miguel,
You did not read my letter very well. I called US Airways the evening
before. I went to the ticket counter at 4:00 AM to show a good faith
attempt to make the flight. I called the travel agency who issued the
tickets the moment they opened. The problem: No one would help.
Regards,
Ray Lozano
www.usairways.tv
Ray Lozano
09-09-2003, 02:46 PM
"Keith Willshaw" <keith@kwillshaw_NoSpam.demon.co.uk> wrote in message news:<bjin1q$f6n$1$8302bc10@news.demon.co.uk>...
> "Ray Lozano" <raylozano@eudoramail.com> wrote in message
> news:bbdaa33f.0309081055.13f8df2f@posting.google.com...
> > US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
> > record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
> > site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
> >
>
> Lets see
>
> You booked a flight which you missed because you didnt check you had
> appropriate travel documents until 24 hours before the trip and
> somehow its their fault !
>
> Airlines are NOT PERMITTED to allow people on international flights
> without adequate documentation, you screwed up, deal with it.
>
> Keith
You don't read well and your writing is bad. The issue is not about
personal responsibility, but about how an airline should behave toward
its customers, who are human.
Ray Lozano
www.usairways.tv
Ray Lozano
09-09-2003, 02:48 PM
jim@jibbering.com (Jim Ley) wrote in message news:<3f5cd6c5.76365597@news.cis.dfn.de>...
> On Mon, 08 Sep 2003 19:18:53 GMT, mnc@admin.u.nu (Miguel Cruz) wrote:
>
> >I don't get it.
> >
> >And now you want USAir to pay you thousands of dollars?
>
> You're missing the simple fact that many people aren't prepared to
> accept they made a mistake (or lots in this case) and swallow their
> pride. They have to blame someone else.
>
> Jim.
You must not have any customers of your own. If you do, you probably
don't have very many.
Ray Lozano
www.usairways.tv
Ray Lozano
09-09-2003, 02:51 PM
Keeger <Strat59_00@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<6uvplv0rf6p9a14v4nkm4vectuv8ng25vk@4ax.com>...
> jim@jibbering.com (Jim Ley) wrote:
>
> >You're missing the simple fact that many people aren't prepared to
> >accept they made a mistake (or lots in this case) and swallow their
> >pride. They have to blame someone else.
> >Jim.
>
> God bless America! I think he should sue for at least 3 billion
> dollars.
>
> K
Why not 5 billion?
Ray Lozano
www.usairways.tv
JohnDoe
09-09-2003, 03:43 PM
On 8 Sep 2003 20:46:05 -0700, raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray Lozano)
wrote:
>
>You don't read well and your writing is bad. The issue is not about
>personal responsibility, but about how an airline should behave toward
>its customers, who are human.
>
wrong bevis, it is all about personal responsibility, you failed to
have with you the required documents and you are blaming the airline
which is just doing it's duty to follow the law. Next time when you're
in the wrong try acting a bit more contrite, it might get people who
can assist you to assist you.
JohnDoe
09-09-2003, 03:44 PM
On 8 Sep 2003 20:48:56 -0700, raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray Lozano)
wrote:
>You must not have any customers of your own. If you do, you probably
>don't have very many.
>
no business needs customers like you
JohnDoe
09-09-2003, 03:45 PM
On 8 Sep 2003 20:51:56 -0700, raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray Lozano)
wrote:
>Keeger <Strat59_00@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<6uvplv0rf6p9a14v4nkm4vectuv8ng25vk@4ax.com>...
>> jim@jibbering.com (Jim Ley) wrote:
>>
>> >You're missing the simple fact that many people aren't prepared to
>> >accept they made a mistake (or lots in this case) and swallow their
>> >pride. They have to blame someone else.
>> >Jim.
>>
>> God bless America! I think he should sue for at least 3 billion
>> dollars.
>>
>> K
>
>Why not 5 billion?
go for 10, you still would never prevail
Keith Willshaw
09-09-2003, 05:45 PM
"Ray Lozano" <raylozano@eudoramail.com> wrote in message
news:bbdaa33f.0309081946.639a1a5f@posting.google.com...
> "Keith Willshaw" <keith@kwillshaw_NoSpam.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:<bjin1q$f6n$1$8302bc10@news.demon.co.uk>...
> > "Ray Lozano" <raylozano@eudoramail.com> wrote in message
> > news:bbdaa33f.0309081055.13f8df2f@posting.google.com...
> > > US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
> > > record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
> > > site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
> > >
> >
> > Lets see
> >
> > You booked a flight which you missed because you didnt check you had
> > appropriate travel documents until 24 hours before the trip and
> > somehow its their fault !
> >
> > Airlines are NOT PERMITTED to allow people on international flights
> > without adequate documentation, you screwed up, deal with it.
> >
> > Keith
>
> You don't read well and your writing is bad. The issue is not about
> personal responsibility, but about how an airline should behave toward
> its customers, who are human.
I read very well and you want it both ways.
You bought non changeable tickets because they were cheap
and then missed the flight. The airline has no responsibility
either moral or legal to do anything other than they did.
They did nothing wrong and you screwed up. Accept responsibility
for your own actions and stop whining.
Keith
Julie
09-09-2003, 06:11 PM
"Ray Lozano" <raylozano@eudoramail.com> wrote in message
news:bbdaa33f.0309081938.1c8f627b@posting.google.com...
> mnc@admin.u.nu (Miguel Cruz) wrote in message
news:<xC47b.12835$98.4323@nwrddc03.gnilink.net>...
> > Ray Lozano <raylozano@eudoramail.com> wrote:
> > > US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
> > > record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
> > > site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
> > >
> > > Businesses that behave like US Airways do not deserve to survive. One
> > > gets the feeling US Airways is run by vultures picking over the
> > > carcass of a dying business. Travelers beware!
> >
> > I don't get it. You didn't have your travel documents, which are
required by
> > law. You then went out and bought one-way tickets on a different airline
> > rather than following the instructions given by the USAir person to
contact
> > your travel agency.
> >
> > If you had called the travel agency they could have gotten you on the
next
> > USAir flight, possibly at a cost of $700 but definitely not at a cost of
> > $4800.
> >
> > Also, if you had talked with anyone about your plan to purchase the
one-way
> > tickets on American they could have told you that your USAir return
tickets
> > would be voided by failure to use the outbound.
> >
> > And now you want USAir to pay you thousands of dollars?
> >
> > miguel
>
> Miguel,
>
> You did not read my letter very well. I called US Airways the evening
> before. I went to the ticket counter at 4:00 AM to show a good faith
> attempt to make the flight. I called the travel agency who issued the
> tickets the moment they opened. The problem: No one would help.
>
> Regards,
> Ray Lozano
> www.usairways.tv
You still have not explained why birth certificates were in safe deposit nor
why you needed the birth certificates.
Why do you leave everything to the night before you travel.
The airline owes you nothing.
Julie
propp
09-09-2003, 06:54 PM
"JohnDoe" <abuse@bellnexxia.net > wrote in message
news:6mmqlvon1kfb2bhnuoa796vg0cshdrrbdg@4ax.com...
> On 8 Sep 2003 20:51:56 -0700, raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray Lozano)
> wrote:
>
> >Keeger <Strat59_00@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:<6uvplv0rf6p9a14v4nkm4vectuv8ng25vk@4ax.com>...
> >> jim@jibbering.com (Jim Ley) wrote:
> >>
> >> >You're missing the simple fact that many people aren't prepared to
> >> >accept they made a mistake (or lots in this case) and swallow their
> >> >pride. They have to blame someone else.
> >> >Jim.
> >>
> >> God bless America! I think he should sue for at least 3 billion
> >> dollars.
> >>
> >> K
> >
> >Why not 5 billion?
> go for 10, you still would never prevail
If I were Ray, I'd worry more about his website using trademarked logos and
copyrighted articles/photos, without permission.
Not exactly the brightest bulb in the chandelier...seeking restitution for a
situation of his making, all the while creating what amounts to a hate site of
the airline<G>
Listener
09-09-2003, 11:58 PM
I'v e never had a problem flying USAir (many, many times). Of course,
I've always booked direct and always take my passport.
Good luck.
On 8 Sep 2003 11:55:16 -0700, raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray Lozano)
wrote:
>US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
>record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
>site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
>
>Businesses that behave like US Airways do not deserve to survive. One
>gets the feeling US Airways is run by vultures picking over the
>carcass of a dying business. Travelers beware!
>
>Regards,
>Ray Lozano
>Dallas, Texas
>www.usairways.tv
Charlie Hammond
10-09-2003, 12:05 AM
In article <0dhqlv4uapjdf4acnocpco2adbekjuf8ep@4ax.com>,
Hatunen <hatuunen@cox.net> writes:
>When we're about to make an international flight we make sure all
>our papers are in order at least a week before the flight, and
>now you can see why.
If there is a lesson to be learned from this, it is the above.
--
Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA
(hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)
All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.
Charlie Hammond
10-09-2003, 12:13 AM
In article <bjjstq$a7f$1$830fa79d@news.demon.co.uk>,
"Keith Willshaw" <keith@kwillshaw_NoSpam.demon.co.uk> writes:
>You bought non changeable tickets because they were cheap
>and then missed the flight. The airline has no responsibility
>either moral or legal to do anything other than they did.
All true and all besides the point.
I by non-changeable tickets, and I HAVE MISSED flights once or twice.
The airline has accomodated me at no additional charge on the next
available flight.
Now why did US AIR not do that in this case? My guess is that it was
a combinatin of bad luck -- happening to encounter US AIR employees
who were "not having a good day" -- and some lack or persistence on
the part of the original poster -- it sounds like he "panicked" and
ran out to by tickers from another airline before exhausting his
efforts with US AIR. He'll no doubt pay for this, but there is still
the valid point that US AIR could have done better for this customer.
--
Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA
(hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)
All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.
Juliana L Holm
10-09-2003, 12:23 AM
In rec.travel.caribbean Charlie Hammond <hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com> wrote:
> In article <bjjstq$a7f$1$830fa79d@news.demon.co.uk>,
> "Keith Willshaw" <keith@kwillshaw_NoSpam.demon.co.uk> writes:
>>You bought non changeable tickets because they were cheap
>>and then missed the flight. The airline has no responsibility
>>either moral or legal to do anything other than they did.
> All true and all besides the point.
> I by non-changeable tickets, and I HAVE MISSED flights once or twice.
> The airline has accomodated me at no additional charge on the next
> available flight.
How long ago? All airlines changed this policy earlier this year. Some of
them are beginning to back off this policy just this week (too late for you)
> Now why did US AIR not do that in this case? My guess is that it was
> a combinatin of bad luck -- happening to encounter US AIR employees
> who were "not having a good day" -- and some lack or persistence on
> the part of the original poster -- it sounds like he "panicked" and
> ran out to by tickers from another airline before exhausting his
> efforts with US AIR. He'll no doubt pay for this, but there is still
> the valid point that US AIR could have done better for this customer.
Because the policy changed? Because new security regulations make using half
a ticket more difficult for the airline? Corporate Greed? All o fthe above.
> --
> Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA
> (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)
> All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.
--
Julie
**********
Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at
http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm
:>>You bought non changeable tickets because they were cheap
:>>and then missed the flight. The airline has no responsibility
:>>either moral or legal to do anything other than they did.
:>All true and all besides the point.
:>I by non-changeable tickets, and I HAVE MISSED flights once or twice.
:>The airline has accomodated me at no additional charge on the next
:>available flight.
:>Now why did US AIR not do that in this case? My guess is that it was
:>a combinatin of bad luck -- happening to encounter US AIR employees
:>who were "not having a good day" -- and some lack or persistence on
:>the part of the original poster -- it sounds like he "panicked" and
:>ran out to by tickers from another airline before exhausting his
:>efforts with US AIR.
BINGO.
We have a winner.
:> He'll no doubt pay for this, but there is still
:>the valid point that US AIR could have done better for this customer.
Hard to say.
As he never returned to US Air with the required documents to travel, we will
never know.
As he never made an attempt to escalate the issue, we will never know.
raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray Lozano) wrote in message news:<bbdaa33f.0309081951.27b81a07@posting.google.com>...
> Keeger <Strat59_00@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<6uvplv0rf6p9a14v4nkm4vectuv8ng25vk@4ax.com>...
> > jim@jibbering.com (Jim Ley) wrote:
> >
> > >You're missing the simple fact that many people aren't prepared to
> > >accept they made a mistake (or lots in this case) and swallow their
> > >pride. They have to blame someone else.
> > >Jim.
> >
> > God bless America! I think he should sue for at least 3 billion
> > dollars.
> >
> > K
>
> Why not 5 billion?
>
> Ray Lozano
> www.usairways.tv
I am sure you have talked to lawyers to represent you on contingency
basis and no one bit because they didn't want to waste their time?
Yaofeng
Keith Willshaw
10-09-2003, 01:45 AM
"Charlie Hammond" <hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com> wrote in message
news:Xlk7b.4300$KW5.2680@news.cpqcorp.net...
> In article <bjjstq$a7f$1$830fa79d@news.demon.co.uk>,
> "Keith Willshaw" <keith@kwillshaw_NoSpam.demon.co.uk> writes:
>
> >You bought non changeable tickets because they were cheap
> >and then missed the flight. The airline has no responsibility
> >either moral or legal to do anything other than they did.
>
> All true and all besides the point.
>
> I by non-changeable tickets, and I HAVE MISSED flights once or twice.
> The airline has accomodated me at no additional charge on the next
> available flight.
>
Then you may count yourself fortunate, the airline have no obligation
to do so. In my experience they will often do this if its due
to events beyond your control such as breaking down on
the way to the airport etc.
Not having the correct travel documentsdoesnt fall into
this category.
> Now why did US AIR not do that in this case? My guess is that it was
> a combinatin of bad luck -- happening to encounter US AIR employees
> who were "not having a good day" -- and some lack or persistence on
> the part of the original poster -- it sounds like he "panicked" and
> ran out to by tickers from another airline before exhausting his
> efforts with US AIR. He'll no doubt pay for this, but there is still
> the valid point that US AIR could have done better for this customer.
>
If you buy a cut price ticket from a consolidator, which he did,
you cant expect the airline to bend over backwards. In such
a situation the only chance is to be very nice and apologetic
and grovel a little. I doubt the OP was that type to do so.
Keith
Charlie Hammond
10-09-2003, 04:43 AM
In article <bjkpkc$ld3$1@selma.aspentech.com>,
"Keith Willshaw" <keithNoSpam@kwillshaw.demon.co.uk> writes:
...
>If you buy a cut price ticket ...
> ... the only chance [may be] to be very nice and apologetic
>and grovel a little. ...
Yes, this is always a good idea when dealing with gate agents who have
the authority to take actions that will help you a lot, but are not
required to do so. I have on occasion had very good results by being
pleasant and appreciative while others who were "demanding" their
"rights" were frustrated. Standing on priciples is pointless here;
results are what count.
On the other hand... I have also seen gate agents who are not being
as helpful as they might. One American Airlines supervisor comes to
mind from maybe 6-7 years back in Miami. Weather had schedules all
messed up, and nobody this woman dealt with was at all happy. Most
others were getting some relief. On that occasion, but being polite
and appreciative, my wife and I got vouchers for meals and a hotel,
while many others ended up spending the night at the airport.
Of course we were also lucky to avoid dealing with that particular
supervisor.
--
Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA
(hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)
All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.
buggs
10-09-2003, 06:16 AM
well ray,
i did read your letter. again as others have stated, you started the
problem by not having documents as required by law. maybe u.s. air could
have been more helpful, but i have been in the mob behind people who
don't understand rules are for everyone when they tie up clerks for
others for a looooong time at 4:00 a.m.. if you weren't satisfied, you
should have then moved to the side and asked for a supervisor or another
employee. have found that most, not all, service employees return the
demeanor that they receive. a smile and as pleasant an attitude you can
present works well most of the time. and hey folks...as has been printed
in the paper and shown on t.v. news...no shows will have their entire
ticket, including all stops and returns voided. it is one way of knowing
who, more or less is on that plane. hope you get somewhere, but i would
bet it will be little more than a sorry for your experience, and MAYBE a
partial refund of your discounted ticket purchase. just my opinion...but
i have dealt with a few airline problems..u.s.air,delta,america and air
jamaica. none of them anymore seem better or worse on a constant level.
Ray Lozano wrote:
> US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
> record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
> site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
>
> Businesses that behave like US Airways do not deserve to survive. One
> gets the feeling US Airways is run by vultures picking over the
> carcass of a dying business. Travelers beware!
>
> Regards,
> Ray Lozano
> Dallas, Texas
> www.usairways.tv
Miguel Cruz
10-09-2003, 06:21 AM
Ray Lozano <raylozano@eudoramail.com> wrote:
> mnc@admin.u.nu (Miguel Cruz) wrote:
>> Ray Lozano <raylozano@eudoramail.com> wrote:
>>> US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
>>> record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
>>> site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
>>>
>>> Businesses that behave like US Airways do not deserve to survive. One
>>> gets the feeling US Airways is run by vultures picking over the
>>> carcass of a dying business. Travelers beware!
>>
>> I don't get it. You didn't have your travel documents, which are required by
>> law. You then went out and bought one-way tickets on a different airline
>> rather than following the instructions given by the USAir person to contact
>> your travel agency.
>>
>> If you had called the travel agency they could have gotten you on the next
>> USAir flight, possibly at a cost of $700 but definitely not at a cost of
>> $4800.
>>
>> Also, if you had talked with anyone about your plan to purchase the one-way
>> tickets on American they could have told you that your USAir return tickets
>> would be voided by failure to use the outbound.
>>
>> And now you want USAir to pay you thousands of dollars?
>
> You did not read my letter very well. I called US Airways the evening
> before. I went to the ticket counter at 4:00 AM to show a good faith
> attempt to make the flight. I called the travel agency who issued the
> tickets the moment they opened. The problem: No one would help.
I read it plenty well. Just because you did something as a "good faith"
effort doesn't mean it's useful. If I give you a chocolate cake as a "good
faith" effort to have you sign your house over to me, does that create some
sort of obligation on your part?
You called the travel agency after you'd already panicked and purchased the
American Airlines tickets. If you had waited they could have helped. As it
was, it was too late because you'd already gone down that expensive road.
I don't blame you completely; these things are confusing and people aren't
always that helpful. But to try to turn it around and pin it on the airline
is absurd. At the end of the day, the cause of the problem was that you
didn't bring documents which are required by law for an international flight
- a requirement that is well-publicized, and described in every guidebook,
ticket confirmation, etc. Everything else is just a matter of how well other
people handled your mistake.
miguel
--
Hit The Road! Photos and tales from around the world: http://travel.u.nu
Mike McKinley
10-09-2003, 06:28 AM
Miguel Cruz wrote:
> I don't blame you completely; these things are confusing and people
> aren't always that helpful. But to try to turn it around and pin it on
> the airline is absurd. At the end of the day, the cause of the problem
> was that you didn't bring documents which are required by law for an
> international flight - a requirement that is well-publicized, and
> described in every guidebook, ticket confirmation, etc. Everything
> else is just a matter of how well other people handled your mistake.
I can't imagine attempting international travel without a passport.
I wouldn't even cross over to Nuevo Laredo anymore without mine.
--
¿...qué podemos saber las mujeres sino las filosofías de cocina? Bien dijo Lupercio Leonardo, que bien se puede filosofar y aderezar la cena. Y yo suelo decir viendo estas cosillas: Si Aristóteles hubiera guisado, mucho más hubiera escrito."
("...what can we women know, save philosophies of the kitchen? It was well put by Lupercio Leonardo that one can philosophize quite well while preparing supper. I often say, when I make these little observations, "Had Aristotle cooked, he would have writ
ten a great deal more.")
Sor Juana Inés de la Cruz, La Respuesta
Hatunen
10-09-2003, 09:37 AM
On 9 Sep 2003 16:26:11 -0700, raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray
Lozano) wrote:
>Hatunen <hatuunen@cox.net> wrote in message news:<0dhqlv4uapjdf4acnocpco2adbekjuf8ep@4ax.com>...
>>
>> Your screed does not make it clear just who required the
>> documents; was it the ariline or was it the destination country?
>> If the destination country, what, exactly, did you want the
>> airline to do and how are they responsible for it?
>
>Jamaica would have required the documents for entry.
Then if the tickets were denoted with Jamaica as their
destination the airline could do nothing about it. And since you
knew ahead of time this was a requirement and didn't bother to
verify the documents were in your possession until the night
before you were very remiss.
>The original
>itinerary took us from Dallas to Charlotte to Montego Bay. Perhaps we
>could have flown to Charlotte as American citizens, stayed in
>Charlotte at our expense until a family member could send us our birth
>certificates, then fly from Charlotte to Montego Bay.
Only if your tickets to Charlotte didn't show jamaica as your
ultimate destination. And, if you mean differetnt tickets, your
Jamaica tickets would not have survived.
> I would have
>been more than happy to pay US Airways any extra necessary for such an
>arrangement.
>
>> Would a passport have satisifed everyone?
>
>Yes, but a passport is not needed to enter Jamaica.
That's not what I asked.
>> When we're about to make an international flight we make sure all
>> our papers are in order at least a week before the flight, and
>> now you can see why.
>
>Naturally. I lined out everything days before our scheduled departure.
>I made the mistake of assuming our birth certificates were in our home
>files, used on an earlier trip to Mexico, but my wife had moved them
>to safe deposit, with the best of intentions, without my knowledge.
>Simple human error, but I am the wiser for it.
I gather your wife wasn't invovled in the trip planning.
************* DAVE HATUNEN (hatunen@cox.net) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
Ray Lozano
10-09-2003, 10:08 AM
mtbchip <mtbchip@cox.net> wrote in message news:<BB826D91.F3DD%mtbchip@cox.net>...
> in article bbdaa33f.0309081055.13f8df2f@posting.google.com, Ray Lozano at
> raylozano@eudoramail.com wrote on 9/8/03 11:55 AM:
>
> > US Airways is an example of big business gone bad. They have an ample
> > record of mistreating customers and employees. You can view my web
> > site at http://www.usairways.tv to read my story and others.
> >
> > Businesses that behave like US Airways do not deserve to survive. One
> > gets the feeling US Airways is run by vultures picking over the
> > carcass of a dying business. Travelers beware!
> >
> > Regards,
> > Ray Lozano
> > Dallas, Texas
> > www.usairways.tv
>
> Lozano translates to loser in some other language. Be a big boy and swallow
> your mistakes.
As I responded earlier to a comment equally moronic, you probably
don't have customers in your job. If you do, you likely have very few.
Ray Lozano
www.usairways.tv
Ray Lozano
10-09-2003, 10:10 AM
listener@nospam.net (Listener) wrote in message news:<3f5dcee8.607843@news-server.nyc.rr.com>...
> I'v e never had a problem flying USAir (many, many times). Of course,
> I've always booked direct and always take my passport.
>
> Good luck.
Thank you.
Ray Lozano
www.usairways.tv
Ray Lozano
10-09-2003, 10:26 AM
Hatunen <hatuunen@cox.net> wrote in message news:<0dhqlv4uapjdf4acnocpco2adbekjuf8ep@4ax.com>...
>
> Your screed does not make it clear just who required the
> documents; was it the ariline or was it the destination country?
> If the destination country, what, exactly, did you want the
> airline to do and how are they responsible for it?
Jamaica would have required the documents for entry. The original
itinerary took us from Dallas to Charlotte to Montego Bay. Perhaps we
could have flown to Charlotte as American citizens, stayed in
Charlotte at our expense until a family member could send us our birth
certificates, then fly from Charlotte to Montego Bay. I would have
been more than happy to pay US Airways any extra necessary for such an
arrangement.
> Would a passport have satisifed everyone?
Yes, but a passport is not needed to enter Jamaica.
> When we're about to make an international flight we make sure all
> our papers are in order at least a week before the flight, and
> now you can see why.
Naturally. I lined out everything days before our scheduled departure.
I made the mistake of assuming our birth certificates were in our home
files, used on an earlier trip to Mexico, but my wife had moved them
to safe deposit, with the best of intentions, without my knowledge.
Simple human error, but I am the wiser for it.
Best regards,
Ray Lozano
www.usairways.tv
Bert Hyman
10-09-2003, 10:29 AM
In news:bbdaa33f.0309091526.6fdbed42@posting.google.com
raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray Lozano) wrote:
> Simple human error, but I am the wiser for it.
Then why did you start this thread?
--
Bert Hyman St. Paul, MN bert@visi.com
mrtravel
10-09-2003, 10:34 AM
Ray Lozano wrote:
> Hatunen <hatuunen@cox.net> wrote in message news:<0dhqlv4uapjdf4acnocpco2adbekjuf8ep@4ax.com>...
>
>>Your screed does not make it clear just who required the
>>documents; was it the ariline or was it the destination country?
>>If the destination country, what, exactly, did you want the
>>airline to do and how are they responsible for it?
>
>
> Jamaica would have required the documents for entry. The original
> itinerary took us from Dallas to Charlotte to Montego Bay. Perhaps we
> could have flown to Charlotte as American citizens, stayed in
> Charlotte at our expense until a family member could send us our birth
> certificates, then fly from Charlotte to Montego Bay. I would have
> been more than happy to pay US Airways any extra necessary for such an
> arrangement.
>
You wouldn't have needed to stay in Charlotte. You could have left on a
later flight, for money, from Dallas (on US). Then you would have kept
your return intact. The suggest to contact your TA was to reduce the
amount of money you would be out, but it seems you didn't do that.
mrtravel
10-09-2003, 10:37 AM
Bert Hyman wrote:
> In news:bbdaa33f.0309091526.6fdbed42@posting.google.com
> raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray Lozano) wrote:
>
>
>>Simple human error, but I am the wiser for it.
>
>
> Then why did you start this thread?
>
He wanted an opinion of his chances on getting reimbursement of over
$4000 more he had to spend to fix his mistake.
JohnM
10-09-2003, 10:48 AM
In article <BB826D91.F3DD%mtbchip@cox.net>, mtbchip <mtbchip@cox.net>
writes
>Lozano translates to loser in some other language. Be a big boy and swallow
>your mistakes.
>
Frankly this sums up my feelings. The rest of us accept that we are
fallible and that we screw up sometimes - and tough luck. We don't blame
the world for it. But there seems to be a strange litigious mutant of
our species, Homo Americanus, who thinks that a corporation by virtue
of being a corporation is always at fault and that he (or she) by virtue
of being an individual is never at fault. I got cancer from smoking
ciggies? The tobacco companies are at fault. I burnt my hands with
coffee? MacDonalds are at fault. I missed a flight? The airline is at
fault. Oh, grow up!
Ray you fucked up royally, mate. We all have - at some time or another -
but we don't make such a public spectacle of ourselves. Stop digging the
hole you're in, swallow your pride and put it down to experience. It's
the crooked mountain roads that make us better drivers and its the
occasional stumble that enlightens us about life, OK?
--
JohnM
Author of Brazil: Life, Blood, Soul
http://www.scroll.demon.co.uk/spaver.htm
Robert Dickson
10-09-2003, 01:01 PM
I keep thinking back to a trip to St., Thomas a few years ago. We got
to the counter early for a 5:30 am flight and when we got to the
counter, my wife pulled out her drivers license for id. I asked her
where her passport was, and from the look on her face, I knew. I
turned to the counter agent and asked how we could re-book the flight.
She said there was a 7:30 flight if I could get back with her
passport. She put us on standby before I left for home. I got home
and back to the airport by 5:45 and they had us confirmed all the way
through to St. Thomas. She even gave us coupons for drinks or
earphones. I wonder if that was because we asked what could be done,
nd listened.
On Tue, 9 Sep 2003 15:45:15 +0100, "Keith Willshaw"
<keithNoSpam@kwillshaw.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>"Charlie Hammond" <hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com> wrote in message
>news:Xlk7b.4300$KW5.2680@news.cpqcorp.net...
>> In article <bjjstq$a7f$1$830fa79d@news.demon.co.uk>,
>> "Keith Willshaw" <keith@kwillshaw_NoSpam.demon.co.uk> writes:
>>
>> >You bought non changeable tickets because they were cheap
>> >and then missed the flight. The airline has no responsibility
>> >either moral or legal to do anything other than they did.
>>
>> All true and all besides the point.
>>
>> I by non-changeable tickets, and I HAVE MISSED flights once or twice.
>> The airline has accomodated me at no additional charge on the next
>> available flight.
>>
>
>Then you may count yourself fortunate, the airline have no obligation
>to do so. In my experience they will often do this if its due
>to events beyond your control such as breaking down on
>the way to the airport etc.
>
>Not having the correct travel documentsdoesnt fall into
>this category.
>
>> Now why did US AIR not do that in this case? My guess is that it was
>> a combinatin of bad luck -- happening to encounter US AIR employees
>> who were "not having a good day" -- and some lack or persistence on
>> the part of the original poster -- it sounds like he "panicked" and
>> ran out to by tickers from another airline before exhausting his
>> efforts with US AIR. He'll no doubt pay for this, but there is still
>> the valid point that US AIR could have done better for this customer.
>>
>
>If you buy a cut price ticket from a consolidator, which he did,
>you cant expect the airline to bend over backwards. In such
>a situation the only chance is to be very nice and apologetic
>and grovel a little. I doubt the OP was that type to do so.
>
>Keith
>
Bob Dickson
"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does Knowledge." Charles Darwin
Juliana L Holm
10-09-2003, 01:24 PM
Actually, in the last year or two all airlines have tightened up regulations
so that you cannot do this any more. There is at least a significant penalty
you would have paid.
Julie
Robert Dickson <rhdiii@verizon.net> wrote:
> I keep thinking back to a trip to St., Thomas a few years ago. We got
> to the counter early for a 5:30 am flight and when we got to the
> counter, my wife pulled out her drivers license for id. I asked her
> where her passport was, and from the look on her face, I knew. I
> turned to the counter agent and asked how we could re-book the flight.
> She said there was a 7:30 flight if I could get back with her
> passport. She put us on standby before I left for home. I got home
> and back to the airport by 5:45 and they had us confirmed all the way
> through to St. Thomas. She even gave us coupons for drinks or
> earphones. I wonder if that was because we asked what could be done,
> nd listened.
> On Tue, 9 Sep 2003 15:45:15 +0100, "Keith Willshaw"
> <keithNoSpam@kwillshaw.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>"Charlie Hammond" <hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com> wrote in message
>>news:Xlk7b.4300$KW5.2680@news.cpqcorp.net...
>>> In article <bjjstq$a7f$1$830fa79d@news.demon.co.uk>,
>>> "Keith Willshaw" <keith@kwillshaw_NoSpam.demon.co.uk> writes:
>>>
>>> >You bought non changeable tickets because they were cheap
>>> >and then missed the flight. The airline has no responsibility
>>> >either moral or legal to do anything other than they did.
>>>
>>> All true and all besides the point.
>>>
>>> I by non-changeable tickets, and I HAVE MISSED flights once or twice.
>>> The airline has accomodated me at no additional charge on the next
>>> available flight.
>>>
>>
>>Then you may count yourself fortunate, the airline have no obligation
>>to do so. In my experience they will often do this if its due
>>to events beyond your control such as breaking down on
>>the way to the airport etc.
>>
>>Not having the correct travel documentsdoesnt fall into
>>this category.
>>
>>> Now why did US AIR not do that in this case? My guess is that it was
>>> a combinatin of bad luck -- happening to encounter US AIR employees
>>> who were "not having a good day" -- and some lack or persistence on
>>> the part of the original poster -- it sounds like he "panicked" and
>>> ran out to by tickers from another airline before exhausting his
>>> efforts with US AIR. He'll no doubt pay for this, but there is still
>>> the valid point that US AIR could have done better for this customer.
>>>
>>
>>If you buy a cut price ticket from a consolidator, which he did,
>>you cant expect the airline to bend over backwards. In such
>>a situation the only chance is to be very nice and apologetic
>>and grovel a little. I doubt the OP was that type to do so.
>>
>>Keith
>>
> Bob Dickson
> "Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does Knowledge." Charles Darwin
--
Julie
**********
Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at
http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm
David Eduardo
10-09-2003, 02:19 PM
"Ray Lozano" <raylozano@eudoramail.com> wrote in message
news:bbdaa33f.0309091508.128b4d8@posting.google.com...
> mtbchip <mtbchip@cox.net> wrote in message
news:<BB826D91.F3DD%mtbchip@cox.net>...
> >
> > Lozano translates to loser in some other language. Be a big boy and
swallow
> > your mistakes.
>
> As I responded earlier to a comment equally moronic, you probably
> don't have customers in your job. If you do, you likely have very few.
This is analogous to a public place that restricts the entrance of drunks.
If you arrive drunk, you will not be given service. There is no "nice
customer service policy" that will make them admit a drunk.
You arrived under the illegal traveler status. The airline can not fix your
papers. Caveat emptor.
David Eduardo
10-09-2003, 02:21 PM
"Ray Lozano" <raylozano@eudoramail.com> wrote in message
news:bbdaa33f.0309091526.6fdbed42@posting.google.com...
> Naturally. I lined out everything days before our scheduled departure.
> I made the mistake of assuming our birth certificates were in our home
> files, used on an earlier trip to Mexico, but my wife had moved them
> to safe deposit, with the best of intentions, without my knowledge.
> Simple human error, but I am the wiser for it.
So why is the airline responsible for your egregious error?
Jere Lull
10-09-2003, 03:38 PM
Ray Lozano wrote:
>Hatunen <hatuunen@cox.net> wrote in message news:<0dhqlv4uapjdf4acnocpco2adbekjuf8ep@4ax.com>...
>
>
>>When we're about to make an international flight we make sure all
>>our papers are in order at least a week before the flight, and
>>now you can see why.
>>
>>
>
>Naturally. I lined out everything days before our scheduled departure.
>
"days before"? Gosh, we're PACKED, have double checked our lists, taken
half the "stuff" out of our bags, and are ready to roll at least a week
before an international flight.
>I made the mistake of assuming our birth certificates were in our home
>files, used on an earlier trip to Mexico, but my wife had moved them
>to safe deposit, with the best of intentions, without my knowledge.
>
Standard comment about "ass-u-me".... In addition to your waiting to the
last minute, if you'd listened to rec.travel.caribbean and other
newsgroups, you'd have heard that while "raised seal" berth certs and
"government ID" are minimally acceptable, passports make transport
significantly easier, *particularly* when re-entering the US.
>Simple human error, but I am the wiser for it.
>
>
I echo the other comments: it was your errors, and your insistance, that
caused your troubles and extra costs.
Whilst undoubtedly under the effects of alcohol, Bert Hyman
<bert@visi.com> wrote:
>In news:bbdaa33f.0309091526.6fdbed42@posting.google.com
>raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray Lozano) wrote:
>
>> Simple human error, but I am the wiser for it.
>
>Then why did you start this thread?
Because he is an idiot.
=========
Dave
Don't Drink Drive....
It's A Laundry Detergent
propp
10-09-2003, 03:50 PM
"mrtravel" <mrtravel@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:gvt7b.773$UH6.362@newssvr29.news.prodigy.com...
> Bert Hyman wrote:
>
> > In news:bbdaa33f.0309091526.6fdbed42@posting.google.com
> > raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray Lozano) wrote:
> >
> >
> >>Simple human error, but I am the wiser for it.
> >
> >
> > Then why did you start this thread?
> >
>
> He wanted an opinion of his chances on getting reimbursement of over
> $4000 more he had to spend to fix his mistake.
>
Hopefully his $4800 taught him some valuable lessons...
* you're not leaving the country w/o your documents
* you're not flying on the return leg of a RT ticket when you didn't board the
departure leg
* don't show up at the airport at 4am with your family all packed and ready,
when you know you can not fly
* don't panic but seek out and find those that can help and accommodate you
propp
10-09-2003, 03:54 PM
"JohnM" <john@scroll.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:MSRd3SAebmX$Ew8b@scroll.demon.co.uk...
> In article <BB826D91.F3DD%mtbchip@cox.net>, mtbchip <mtbchip@cox.net>
> writes
>
> >Lozano translates to loser in some other language. Be a big boy and swallow
> >your mistakes.
> >
>
> Frankly this sums up my feelings. The rest of us accept that we are
> fallible and that we screw up sometimes - and tough luck. We don't blame
> the world for it. But there seems to be a strange litigious mutant of
> our species, Homo Americanus, who thinks that a corporation by virtue
> of being a corporation is always at fault and that he (or she) by virtue
> of being an individual is never at fault.
There are many Americans who do not share this view, and wish for serious tort
reform of our civil courts. Unfortunately, the legal profession contributes too
well to politicians and candidates...
Jim
10-09-2003, 04:03 PM
"Ray Lozano" <raylozano@eudoramail.com> wrote in message
news:bbdaa33f.0309091526.6fdbed42@posting.google.com...
> Hatunen <hatuunen@cox.net> wrote in message
news:<0dhqlv4uapjdf4acnocpco2adbekjuf8ep@4ax.com>...
> >
> > Your screed does not make it clear just who required the
> > documents; was it the ariline or was it the destination country?
> > If the destination country, what, exactly, did you want the
> > airline to do and how are they responsible for it?
>
> Jamaica would have required the documents for entry. The original
> itinerary took us from Dallas to Charlotte to Montego Bay. Perhaps we
> could have flown to Charlotte as American citizens, stayed in
> Charlotte at our expense until a family member could send us our birth
> certificates, then fly from Charlotte to Montego Bay. I would have
> been more than happy to pay US Airways any extra necessary for such an
> arrangement.
Gee, what you said! It is the requirement of Jamaica that you have these
documents. You didn't have them so why blame US Air for your mistake and for
them following the law?
>
> > Would a passport have satisifed everyone?
>
> Yes, but a passport is not needed to enter Jamaica.
>
Either a certified original birth certificate AND a government issued photo
ID is required OR a Passport. Passport is the intelligent thing to have.
> > When we're about to make an international flight we make sure all
> > our papers are in order at least a week before the flight, and
> > now you can see why.
>
> Naturally. I lined out everything days before our scheduled departure.
> I made the mistake of assuming our birth certificates were in our home
> files, used on an earlier trip to Mexico, but my wife had moved them
> to safe deposit, with the best of intentions, without my knowledge.
> Simple human error, but I am the wiser for it.
>
> Best regards,
> Ray Lozano
Now this is the only thing that you have written that is correct so take a
moment and read it again to yourself. YOU made the mistake and it is YOU
that is responsible and nobody else has any blame on them. They fulfilled
their part of the bargain, YOU didn't fulfill YOUR part. YOU are the one at
fault and YOU are the only one you can sue for failing to get you to your
ultimate location. Don't believe me, ask any attorney that has ever picked
up a book on torts.
Jim
Bert Hyman
10-09-2003, 11:59 PM
mrtravel@sbcglobal.net (mrtravel) wrote in
news:gvt7b.773$UH6.362@newssvr29.news.prodigy.com:
> Bert Hyman wrote:
>
>> In news:bbdaa33f.0309091526.6fdbed42@posting.google.com
>> raylozano@eudoramail.com (Ray Lozano) wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Simple human error, but I am the wiser for it.
>>
>>
>> Then why did you start this thread?
>>
>
> He wanted an opinion of his chances on getting reimbursement of
> over $4000 more he had to spend to fix his mistake.
Claiming that the airline is "predatory", warning people not to fly
on that airline and setting up a Web site to publicize your rants is
not how one asks for an opinion.
