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17-02-2004, 10:48 AM
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#1
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Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
Crack! Came this loud noise just now from inside my garage!
My car is now held ransom in the garage until I fix this!
Upon inspection, the only thing awry is the torsion spring
(bolted transversely across the garage door crossbar opening)
had snapped in two unequal sections (seemingly on it's own).
This three-foot-long three-inch-diameter coil spring seems
to be held on each end with brackets bolted to a transverse
bar which traverses the length of the garage-door opening.
I never even noticed the thing before; and, I'm not quite
sure what it does, but, the owners manual for the door calls
it a 'torsion' spring.
QUESTION 1:
Why would this strong torsion spring break all by itself?
Presumably the answer is that it was weakened from four
years of daily opening and finally broke on its own
(the garage door was down & quiescent at the time).
QUESTION 2:
If one torsion spring broke - would installing two be better?
The presumption is that the 2-car steel garage door may be
a bit too heavy for the one 3-foot torsion spring installed
by the previous owner. This 3-inch wide torsion spring is
mounted centrally on one side of the cross beam parallel
to the door & perpendicular to the direction the door opens.
Would two torsion springs be indicated if one snaps or is
snapping springs every four years a normal situation?
QUESTION 3:
Some Internet posts intimate it's a do-it-yourself job;
others provide dire warnings. It's hard to tell (did you ever
hear all the dire warnings about doing your own disc brake
pad replacement? Or climbing on the roof to mount an antenna.
You can never tell (heck, when it drizzles out here in the bay
area, the radio stations call it a 'storm' & caution against
driving). Everyone is a wussie when it comes to admonition.
Is this something a basic DIY should tackle (I have only
basic know how, nothing special ... but I've never had my
car fixed by a mechanic, for example, so I can do a few things).
Obviously I've never installed a torsion spring before (I'm still
not sure how it 'balances' the door), nor what 'special' tools
might be needed to install it. (Home Depot has them for 30 bucks
in stock; but I'm not sure exactly how to get the right size.)
I simply ask that someone who has done the job themselves, please
advise me on the three questions above.
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17-02-2004, 10:49 AM
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#2
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Re: Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
On 14 Feb 2004 21:03:06 -0800, brokenklutz@yahoo.com (DIY Klutz)
wrote:
>Crack! Came this loud noise just now from inside my garage!
>My car is now held ransom in the garage until I fix this!
>
>Upon inspection, the only thing awry is the torsion spring
>(bolted transversely across the garage door crossbar opening)
>had snapped in two unequal sections (seemingly on it's own).
>
>This three-foot-long three-inch-diameter coil spring seems
>to be held on each end with brackets bolted to a transverse
>bar which traverses the length of the garage-door opening.
>I never even noticed the thing before; and, I'm not quite
>sure what it does, but, the owners manual for the door calls
>it a 'torsion' spring.
>
>QUESTION 1:
> Why would this strong torsion spring break all by itself?
>
> Presumably the answer is that it was weakened from four
> years of daily opening and finally broke on its own
> (the garage door was down & quiescent at the time).
>
>QUESTION 2:
> If one torsion spring broke - would installing two be better?
>
> The presumption is that the 2-car steel garage door may be
> a bit too heavy for the one 3-foot torsion spring installed
> by the previous owner. This 3-inch wide torsion spring is
> mounted centrally on one side of the cross beam parallel
> to the door & perpendicular to the direction the door opens.
>
> Would two torsion springs be indicated if one snaps or is
> snapping springs every four years a normal situation?
>
>QUESTION 3:
> Some Internet posts intimate it's a do-it-yourself job;
> others provide dire warnings. It's hard to tell (did you ever
> hear all the dire warnings about doing your own disc brake
> pad replacement? Or climbing on the roof to mount an antenna.
> You can never tell (heck, when it drizzles out here in the bay
> area, the radio stations call it a 'storm' & caution against
> driving). Everyone is a wussie when it comes to admonition.
>
> Is this something a basic DIY should tackle (I have only
> basic know how, nothing special ... but I've never had my
> car fixed by a mechanic, for example, so I can do a few things).
>
>Obviously I've never installed a torsion spring before (I'm still
>not sure how it 'balances' the door), nor what 'special' tools
>might be needed to install it. (Home Depot has them for 30 bucks
>in stock; but I'm not sure exactly how to get the right size.)
>
>I simply ask that someone who has done the job themselves, please
>advise me on the three questions above.
Mine broke last year. But then I had two on each door, since the
door has a lot of wood on it and is VERY heavy. Mine broke close to
the end so I heated it with a torch and bent a new hook on the end.
Why worry about why. Things happen.
PJ
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17-02-2004, 10:49 AM
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#3
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Re: Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
According to DIY Klutz <brokenklutz@yahoo.com>:
> QUESTION 1:
> Why would this strong torsion spring break all by itself?
Spring steel fatigues over time. Though, these springs usually last a
very long time.
> QUESTION 2:
> If one torsion spring broke - would installing two be better?
Only if the door had provision for two.
> QUESTION 3:
> Some Internet posts intimate it's a do-it-yourself job;
It's one of the few things I won't do. I have done considerable
work on garage doors (up to and including jamming the spring stationary
so I could disassemble the door in situ to replace wooden bits (ie:
rotting rails on panel doors).
Theoretically, it's pretty straight forward, however, there's one
hell of a lot of tension in one, and a slight mistake could do really
bad things to you.
It's the "trying to hold onto it and wind it up" issue. If it slips,
you might get whatever you're using as a "crank" (steel bar or big
screwdriver etc.) right thru your head. Or lose fingers.
--
Chris Lewis, Una confibula non set est
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.
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17-02-2004, 10:49 AM
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#4
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Re: Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
The question as to what caused it to "suddenly" snap, is obviously the
easiest place to start, it's mechanical, man-made....enough said with
regards to why it happened. Replacing a torsion spring on a garage door or
any other mechanism that utilize them is DANGEROUS, yes I have read all of
the Warnings on everything from replacing a water heater thermostat to
putting air in my kid's basketball. Torsion springs are not within the
domain of the DIY'er. With all respect to PJ's advice to you, I personally
know two men, 1 deceased and one facially disfigured because they were
simply adjusting the torsion spring's tension. It truly is dangerous. You
can buy or rent the tool you referred to, it is commonly referred to as a
spring tensioning tool and to give you an idea of the serious nature of this
procedure, even with this tool, it is illegal in many states for equipment
rental/sales companies to make these tools available to individuals who do
not posess certification in their use. Your dialect indicates an
intellectual as well as analytical thought process.....please do not ignore
it.
"DIY Klutz" <brokenklutz@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1dfb2e58.0402142103.7d9a6f25@posting.google.c om...
> Crack! Came this loud noise just now from inside my garage!
> My car is now held ransom in the garage until I fix this!
>
> Upon inspection, the only thing awry is the torsion spring
> (bolted transversely across the garage door crossbar opening)
> had snapped in two unequal sections (seemingly on it's own).
>
> This three-foot-long three-inch-diameter coil spring seems
> to be held on each end with brackets bolted to a transverse
> bar which traverses the length of the garage-door opening.
> I never even noticed the thing before; and, I'm not quite
> sure what it does, but, the owners manual for the door calls
> it a 'torsion' spring.
>
> QUESTION 1:
> Why would this strong torsion spring break all by itself?
>
> Presumably the answer is that it was weakened from four
> years of daily opening and finally broke on its own
> (the garage door was down & quiescent at the time).
>
> QUESTION 2:
> If one torsion spring broke - would installing two be better?
>
> The presumption is that the 2-car steel garage door may be
> a bit too heavy for the one 3-foot torsion spring installed
> by the previous owner. This 3-inch wide torsion spring is
> mounted centrally on one side of the cross beam parallel
> to the door & perpendicular to the direction the door opens.
>
> Would two torsion springs be indicated if one snaps or is
> snapping springs every four years a normal situation?
>
> QUESTION 3:
> Some Internet posts intimate it's a do-it-yourself job;
> others provide dire warnings. It's hard to tell (did you ever
> hear all the dire warnings about doing your own disc brake
> pad replacement? Or climbing on the roof to mount an antenna.
> You can never tell (heck, when it drizzles out here in the bay
> area, the radio stations call it a 'storm' & caution against
> driving). Everyone is a wussie when it comes to admonition.
>
> Is this something a basic DIY should tackle (I have only
> basic know how, nothing special ... but I've never had my
> car fixed by a mechanic, for example, so I can do a few things).
>
> Obviously I've never installed a torsion spring before (I'm still
> not sure how it 'balances' the door), nor what 'special' tools
> might be needed to install it. (Home Depot has them for 30 bucks
> in stock; but I'm not sure exactly how to get the right size.)
>
> I simply ask that someone who has done the job themselves, please
> advise me on the three questions above.
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17-02-2004, 10:49 AM
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#5
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Re: Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
brokenklutz@yahoo.com (DIY Klutz) wrote:
>Obviously I've never installed a torsion spring before (I'm still
>not sure how it 'balances' the door), nor what 'special' tools
>might be needed to install it. (Home Depot has them for 30 bucks
>in stock; but I'm not sure exactly how to get the right size.)
I've done 20 years worth of home maintenance, but reinstalling a torsion spring
is one job I won't do.
It's not that it looks particularly hard. It's that there is a huge amount of
energy stored in one of those devices when they are wound up. Making one stupid
little mistake will take an arm or eye out or worse.
I'm sure there are lots of people who have learned the proper way to do it safe
and a few more that have done it once or twice with no problem. Me? I'd prefer
the odds in Vegas.
By stating what you did above, I would recommend that you not either.
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17-02-2004, 10:49 AM
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#6
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Re: Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
"Bill Seurer" <Bill@seurer.netNOSPAM> wrote in message news:c0n10r024r7@enews3.newsguy.com...
> As for why they break, well, they're a big spring doing fairly heavy
> work in possibly nasty weather. Stuff weakens and breaks under those
> conditions.
Sure, metal fatigue.
Prove to yourself. Take 2 pairs of pliers and bend a thin strip of
metal back and forth until it breaks.
Don
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17-02-2004, 10:49 AM
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#7
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Re: Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
I just finished installing a torsion spring single garage door.. I purchased
it from a business that really wanted to do the install for me, but I lived
about 60 miles from their shop, so they just sold it to me with some
warnings about the dangers of setting up the torsion spring..
The manual that came with the door also gave additional cautions and advice
to have the professionals do it..
As a Life Long DIY, I did it myself, following the step by step
instructions. When I was finished, I was a nervious wreck. As the spring got
tighter, the more I became aware of the dangerous situation I had gotten
myself into. Towards the end of the process, it is necessary to lock the
spring and do some trial lefts on the door to see now much more torsion is
required.. As might be expected, I needed a few more turns.. This I did and
again it was scary, releasing the lock screws while holding that bar. This
time I took several turns, just to make sure I wouldn't have to release it
again..
As it turns out I never got hurt, however the spring has just a little bit
too much torsion, but I just force the door all the way down and hope the
spring will relax in time..
Even with this experience under my DIY Belt, I don't think I would want to
do it for a living..
--
My opinion and experience. FWIW
Steve
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17-02-2004, 10:49 AM
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#8
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Re: Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
"DIY Klutz" <brokenklutz@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1dfb2e58.0402142103.7d9a6f25@posting.google.c om...
> Crack! Came this loud noise just now from inside my garage!
> My car is now held ransom in the garage until I fix this!
>
> Upon inspection, the only thing awry is the torsion spring
> (bolted transversely across the garage door crossbar opening)
> had snapped in two unequal sections (seemingly on it's own).
>
> This three-foot-long three-inch-diameter coil spring seems
> to be held on each end with brackets bolted to a transverse
> bar which traverses the length of the garage-door opening.
> I never even noticed the thing before; and, I'm not quite
> sure what it does, but, the owners manual for the door calls
> it a 'torsion' spring.
>
> QUESTION 1:
> Why would this strong torsion spring break all by itself?
>
Umm... metal fatigue?
It's a machine. parts break. This is the way of the world.
You say that you "aren't quite sure what it does." Sounds like the best
thing to do is do find someone who understands garage door openers and pay
them to fix it for you.
> Presumably the answer is that it was weakened from four
> years of daily opening and finally broke on its own
> (the garage door was down & quiescent at the time).
>
> QUESTION 2:
> If one torsion spring broke - would installing two be better?
>
> The presumption is that the 2-car steel garage door may be
> a bit too heavy for the one 3-foot torsion spring installed
> by the previous owner. This 3-inch wide torsion spring is
> mounted centrally on one side of the cross beam parallel
> to the door & perpendicular to the direction the door opens.
>
> Would two torsion springs be indicated if one snaps or is
> snapping springs every four years a normal situation?
>
> QUESTION 3:
> Some Internet posts intimate it's a do-it-yourself job;
> others provide dire warnings. It's hard to tell (did you ever
> hear all the dire warnings about doing your own disc brake
> pad replacement? Or climbing on the roof to mount an antenna.
> You can never tell (heck, when it drizzles out here in the bay
> area, the radio stations call it a 'storm' & caution against
> driving). Everyone is a wussie when it comes to admonition.
>
> Is this something a basic DIY should tackle (I have only
> basic know how, nothing special ... but I've never had my
> car fixed by a mechanic, for example, so I can do a few things).
>
> Obviously I've never installed a torsion spring before (I'm still
> not sure how it 'balances' the door), nor what 'special' tools
> might be needed to install it. (Home Depot has them for 30 bucks
> in stock; but I'm not sure exactly how to get the right size.)
>
> I simply ask that someone who has done the job themselves, please
> advise me on the three questions above.
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17-02-2004, 10:49 AM
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#9
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Re: Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
>it.
>"DIY Klutz" <brokenklutz@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:1dfb2e58.0402142103.7d9a6f25@posting.google.c om...
>> Crack! Came this loud noise just now from inside my garage!
>> My car is now held ransom in the garage until I fix this!
>>
Steel and other metals have a physical characteristic called
"brittleness". If your garage was unusually cold at the time of the
break, that would be a reasonable cause. All springs will break over
a period of time (whether you are dealing with extreme temps or not).
I agree with the other posters here in that, unless you are 100% sure
of what you are doing, this is the one job that you probably are
better off paying someone else to do.
That's why the yellow pages (around here anyway) are filled with radio
dispatched garage door service firms that mostly go around and replace
broken springs.
I was lucky to get an honest and experienced technician when mine
broke last year. He knew exactly what to do, had the correct
replacement in his truck, fixed it himself in less than an hour, and
charged me a reasonable $85.00. For that price he also adjusted the
chain drive and taught me how to reset the combination on my outdoor
keypad. The new spring is guaranteed for something like two years.
Beachcomber
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17-02-2004, 10:49 AM
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#10
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Re: Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
Beachcomber wrote:
>> it.
>> "DIY Klutz" <brokenklutz@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:1dfb2e58.0402142103.7d9a6f25@posting.google.c om...
>>> Crack! Came this loud noise just now from inside my garage!
>>> My car is now held ransom in the garage until I fix this!
>>>
>
> Steel and other metals have a physical characteristic called
> "brittleness". If your garage was unusually cold at the time of the
> break, that would be a reasonable cause. All springs will break over
> a period of time (whether you are dealing with extreme temps or not).
>
> I agree with the other posters here in that, unless you are 100% sure
> of what you are doing, this is the one job that you probably are
> better off paying someone else to do.
>
> That's why the yellow pages (around here anyway) are filled with radio
> dispatched garage door service firms that mostly go around and replace
> broken springs.
>
> I was lucky to get an honest and experienced technician when mine
> broke last year. He knew exactly what to do, had the correct
> replacement in his truck, fixed it himself in less than an hour, and
> charged me a reasonable $85.00. For that price he also adjusted the
> chain drive and taught me how to reset the combination on my outdoor
> keypad. The new spring is guaranteed for something like two years.
>
> Beachcomber
It's incredible how some people would risk their life or at least thousands
of dollars in medical expenses just to save a few bucks. SOME repairs are
dangerous and should be left to the experts. Period.
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17-02-2004, 10:49 AM
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#11
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Re: Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
I've done it three times, and prefer not to each time. Most important
thing is to have two winding bars and good insurance, along with
prepaid funeral insurance.
Torsion springs are good for about 10,000 operations. Mine are
still intact, and I'm currently considering changing my system to an
extension spring arrangement so that I can be more comfortable
about doing the work in the future. I think I can make that conversion
for less cost than having someone come out to replace a spring (if one
were to break, I'd replace both) or go through the dread again of
doing it myself. There is just so much energy sitting there, one false move
and you're injured or dead. Simple as that. It's not like you'd see it
coming, either. It just.....happens. And when it does, when a winding
cone breaks, when a winding bar isn't quite right, whatever, no one is
quick enough to get out of the way.
Ya know, I suggest you not be an example of gene pool chlorination.
Does that answer your questions?.
DIY Klutz <brokenklutz@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1dfb2e58.0402142103.7d9a6f25@posting.google.c om...
> I simply ask that someone who has done the job themselves, please
> advise me on the three questions above.
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17-02-2004, 10:49 AM
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#12
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Re: Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
Yes it needs the spring. It is the counterweight.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Keep the whole world singing. . . .
DanG
<nicksanspam@ece.villanova.edu> wrote in message
news:c0nolj$el0@acadia.ece.villanova.edu...
> Bill Seurer <Bill@seurer.netNOSPAM> wrote:
>
> >The spring(s) should be sized to the door.
>
> Does a garage door with an electric opener need a spring?
>
> What ever happened to counterweights?
>
> Nick
>
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17-02-2004, 10:50 AM
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#13
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Re: Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
On 14 Feb 2004 21:03:06 -0800, brokenklutz@yahoo.com (DIY Klutz)
wrote:
>Crack! Came this loud noise just now from inside my garage!
>My car is now held ransom in the garage until I fix this!
Your car is not "held ransom" by anything except, possibly, your
failure to realize that you can pull the little red cord hanging from
the toggle bar on the GDO and yourself raise the door by exerting a
little effort.
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17-02-2004, 10:50 AM
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#14
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Re: Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
Wrong answer. If you were more familiar with the subject, you'd
understand why.
In fact, it will require considerable effort, but it can be done, even if
it's a little at a time with scissors jacks on the broken-spring side.
Slinky <slinky@do.fysh.not.org.spam> wrote in message
news:b6uu201o5ivcieou68392qkpb524k5es9c@4ax.com...
> On 14 Feb 2004 21:03:06 -0800, brokenklutz@yahoo.com (DIY Klutz)
> wrote:
>
> >Crack! Came this loud noise just now from inside my garage!
> >My car is now held ransom in the garage until I fix this!
>
> Your car is not "held ransom" by anything except, possibly, your
> failure to realize that you can pull the little red cord hanging from
> the toggle bar on the GDO and yourself raise the door by exerting a
> little effort.
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17-02-2004, 10:50 AM
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#15
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Re: Why would a garage door torsion spring break & is two better than one?
That's been my view as well. But even a routinely competent
DIY had better pay serious attention to what's being done.
Duane Bozarth <dp_bozarth@swko.dot.net> wrote in message
news:402F82F5.A4BF736@swko.dot.net...
> However, I will note that given
> the need to ask the question (and your ng moniker), I'd judge you're
> <not> in that category--it's probably a case of "better safe than
> sorry".
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